UpSpiral Leadership

Sue Covelli-Buntley of UpSpiral Leadership interview Rosie Corvo. She is the UpSpiral Leadership team's general manager. But before that, Rosie has had an amazing career in finance for 30 years. She has served as the Head of Risk UKRB for Barclays Bank. Then she moved on to become the Chief Administrative Officer and Chief Marketing Officer at Early Warning Services. While there, she had a pivotal role in launching the fintech brand Zelle.

[00:38] Introducing Rosie Corvo

[02:29] Components of Strategic Planning

[07:21] Adapting to Rapid Fire Change

[14:28] Human Capital Investment Strategies

[23:46] Pause and Rise Above

[28:52] This Simple Leadership Exercise will Change your Business

[33:08] The Lightning Round

According to Rosie, strategic planning has three phases. You begin the process by thinking about the future of the business. How do you add value for your stakeholders? How do you stay relevant in the future? Once you’ve answered those questions, move on to capacity assessment. Evaluate whether the available resources are enough to fulfill your set goals. Finally, the last step is prioritization. With the finite resources, focus on specific tasks that will serve the growth of the business.

A strong strategic plan not only considers the business, but also the people. With the advent of digitization, globalization, ESG, and COVID-19, the environment is nothing like before.

Change is happening at a rapid fire pace, it’s crucial to equip employees with skills that can keep them and the business moving forward. It’s equally important to reduce turnover rate to avoid knowledge gaps within the organization.

Studies have shown that effective leadership training decreases turnover rate by almost 77%. People yearn for purposeful work. Knowing these facts, seize the opportunity to develop more leaders. Provide coaching or group coaching not just for executives, but for everyone. Coaching small teams can help deepen bonds and facilitate transfer of wisdom from different departments.

Sue Covelli-Buntley is joined today by Kim Sandifer, a Lead HR Business Partner at HALO Solutions and most recently held the position of Vice President, HR Business Partner to C-Suite and Senior Leaders at CNA Insurance. She is a Human Resources executive with a consistent track record of enabling business results by delivering value added HR Consultation. Kim has over fifteen years of experience as a business partner connecting talent strategies to business outcomes and ensuring HR processes and programs are practical, deliver value and create a great employee experience.

[00:30] Introducing Kim Sandifer

[05:22] Setting Boundaries and the Meaning of Work-Life Integration

[11:45] How to Set Boundaries

[23:23] Learning Through Others, Creating Dialogue, and Doing Well at Work

[40:50] Lightning Round

[46:51] Closing Notes

Kim doesn’t believe in work-life balance. Instead, she believes in balance as integration. Achieving work-life integration is a journey; each phase of the journey may feel different and how you go about attaining balance or equilibrium in your life looks different at every stage. Setting boundaries is a way to go about establishing that integration and can look very different for each of us as individuals. The paradigm of work-life balance 20 years ago was about perfection: you could be a working mom and juggle so many balls at the same time, which created a false perception of work-life balance. Kim looks at integration as self-reflection for our own personal idea of success “how do you focus where you need to focus and be present where you need to be present throughout the day?"

Putting boundaries in place allows us the mental capacity to be present in whatever we’re doing, whether in our work or in our personal life. Kim believes that when we don’t set boundaries, we can't show up as our best selves because of stress and exhaustion. She advises two things: first is to let go of myths such as working long hours to "prove" success. The second is letting go of the mindset that a perfect means having a perfect life. As a mom herself, what’s important is the time spent with her partner and children. Boundaries offer protection and freedom to achieve personal and career goals.

Another mental model that Kim advocates for is knowing that you have a tribe you can reach out to for help. Among companies, there is a fear of having an open dialogue because leaders feel unable to give options or solutions to their peoples’ problems. For Kim, the solution comes from the dialogue. These solutions can look different in every organization and is not a one-size-fits-all but if organizations don’t know what’s going on, they can’t help people to figure out which solutions to put in place.

Kim advises to keep asking questions and challenging one another, because that’s the only way we can help each other step back and rethink possibilities. One of the things Kim is most grateful for is that she can see things differently and expand her thinking, and she predicts that the conversation around integration and work-life balance is going to look so different in the years to come. Forget the whats: how do we get it done?

Gratitude is extremely critical for mental health and just being grounded, centered, and graceful is something we need to be as well as to provide more for each other. If we can come from a place of grace and assume positive intent, it ends with better outcomes. When having difficult conversations, if you assume positive intent and give people grace, if you can look at the situation through a different lens, and Kim thinks that this mindset can help us progress better as human beings.

Poyee Chiu of UpSpiral Leadership interviews Faith Hassel. Faith currently serves as the Lead Community and Customer Manager at National Grid. Both Faith and Poyee volunteer and serve as Officers and Board of Directors for the Leadership Forum Community.

[00:30] Introducing Faith Hassell
[04:41] Faith’s Perspective on Change
[10:09] The Impact of Faith’s Handbell Choir
[14:58] Faith’s Challenges
[22:05] Faith’s Advice and Lightning Round
[31:09] Mindset Reset: “Conflict is scary and holds us back from progress”

A story that really highlighted her journey of change was how Faith used to be a handbell choir ringer since she was ten years old which she loved and still loves doing. When she was in high school, her school didn’t have a handbell choir, so she decided to start her own by collecting her girlfriends and petitioning the school board to buy them handbells. They went around to local nursing homes, libraries, retirement convents for nuns. What she loves about handbell choir is that it shows how important teamwork is—if one person is missing, they could still play their song, but they could be missing crucial tones to make the song happen.

Faith is glad that she took the chance to create her own handbell choir. Though she believes she wasn’t the perfect leader and would have done things differently now, she can look back on it and be amazed that she created it along with her friends, gave back to her community, and performed in front of people who have never heard of handbells before. Her advice to the listeners is to take that step, whether or not they hear that voice that’s talking down on you, change the dialogue in your head, take a leap of faith, give it a chance. It also helps to be surrounded with a group of people who support you, like Faith’s family which Poyee calls “collective leadership”.

Some of the challenges that Faith faces are internal. Leaders are very quick to find their own flaws but it’s very easy to point out all the great things in other people. It’s a challenge to have all these internal thoughts and Faith thinks it’s okay to recognize these thoughts, but not believe them and have people remind you of your strength and the good that you do. Faith looks up to other leaders and groups and tries to identify the things that could apply to her and help move her along as a leader.

The leadership trait that the world needs most is love. As a religious person, Faith thinks that so many things create love and love is many things. If you lead with love, that will be able to change the world. The person that best embodies this trait for Faith is her friend and mentor who she finds is always patient, kind, always lends a hand, always slow to anger, and embodies everything that love is. She also believes that the smallest thing can change leadership and starting something that you’re passionate with can grow and create a community, which creates leadership. As long as you take a leap of faith and step outside your comfort zone, there’s an everyday opportunity for everyday leadership. Seizing those moments that are presented to you, you will see yourself grow as a leader and see that you are making meaningful change happen.

Sue Covelli-Buntley and Poyee Chiu of UpSpiral Leadership interview Bill Hunnex. For the past 30 years, he has been focused on improving organizations through behavioral management training and TQM. Bill’s belief that courageous dialogue stems from authentic human connection has really shone through in the training programs that he’s done for companies like Wall Street, American Express, and TIME Magazine.

[00:42] Introducing Bill Hunnex

[06:09] Learning from and Stepping Up to Career Transitions

[15:15] How to Start Courageous Dialogues

[20:50] Changing the Culture of MMBB

[28:35] Lightning Round: A Series of Brief Questions

[38:21] Mindset Reset: “It is only worth having courageous conversations with those you know and trust most”

Bill has had a very colorful career transitioning from healthcare to community work and to corporations. In every new role, he has accepted unfamiliar challenges and tasks. Moving to New York proved to be one of the best life decisions he’s ever made. He had the opportunity to learn from diverse people and to adapt to new environments. It was in all these changes that Bill learned the most about himself.

When Bill introduced management training to organizations, he emphasized listening skills⎯the core of courageous dialogue. People are so preoccupied about their own responses in a conversation that they fail to really hear each other out. To start courageous dialogue, we must learn to connect with each other on a personal level. Let the other person know that they’ve been heard.

During his time at the Missionaries and Ministers Benefit Board (MMBB), Bill was tasked to improve the organization’s culture. At the time, MMBB had strong ties to its customers but had an authoritarian management style and inefficient operations. The organization needed to cultivate a supportive environment. Bill modeled the behavior that he wanted to see more of: he was respectful and attentive in every interaction. Next, he changed systems. Personal incentive goals were all published, thereby promoting transparency. To address problems, Bill encouraged the members to focus on what could be improved. Blaming others was unproductive. In fact, he even asked for more complaints so that issues could be resolved.

According to Bill, the leadership trait that the world needs the most is forgiveness. You cannot lead if you do not forgive others. Similarly, you must also forgive yourself. Acknowledge your mistakes and then move on. Everyone has the ability to forgive. We all have our own grudges and regrets but we try to rise up from them every day.

Sue Covelli-Buntley and Poyee Chiu of UpSpiral Leadership interview Anne Hunnex. She has had a long and successful career transforming the work culture of numerous organizations. As a firm believer in leadership development, Anne also serves as the Leadership Forum Community’s treasurer even in her retirement.

[00:31] Introducing Anne Hunnex

[03:25] Anne’s Passion for Creating Change

[10:00] Finding Your Voice and Using It for Good

[15:32] Getting Things Done with Empathy and Kindness

[19:12] How to Create Leadership Opportunities for Others

[22:26] Discovering other People’s Strengths & Purpose

[24:45] Waterfall to Agile IT Transformation

[26:37] Lightning Round: A Series of Brief Questions

[33:42] The Flip: “It is Too Late to Invest in Leadership Development”

[36:28] Leadership Forum Summit

Early on in Anne’s career, she experienced firsthand how some work environments can be so damaging. She recalls how she had to deal with a leader who often berated the other employees. Because this leader had so much experience and expertise, nobody dared to speak out against her. Instead of turning a blind eye, Anne approached human resources regarding her abusive actions. HR set up a meeting for them and provided counseling to correct the leader’s destructive behavior.

Anne’s act of courage helped strengthen the bond between her and her team because she had their back and was willing to advocate for them. At this moment, Anne realized that her voice could indeed make a difference. It wasn’t long before the other employees started becoming more outspoken in the workplace.

Anne also learned from this experience how to address the undesired behavior. To truly change behavior, you need to get to the root cause. After identifying the reason for it, assess if you can do anything to address it. Seeking to understand others is the first step to helping them. Every interaction is an opportunity to help or to hurt. Choose to do the former. Remember that words leave a lasting impact whether you realize it or not.

Anne believes that each person is capable of becoming a leader. It’s just a matter of providing leadership opportunities to more people. Leadership is a skill that gets better the more we are able to practice it. It’s never too late nor too early to learn. The opportunities to grow are endless. By encouraging leaders from all backgrounds, we are allowing them to use their talents for good.

But how do we recognize what each other’s talents are? We must get to know people on a deeper level. Ask questions, engage in activities outside of work, and interact in new social environments. Be genuinely curious about their passions and hobbies. If you build enough trust in a relationship, people will be willing to share more about their personal lives. Engaging with others gives us a more accurate picture of who they are and challenges our initial assumptions about them.

Sue Covelli-Buntley and Poyee Chiu of UpSpiral Leadership interview Melissa Nelson and Angie Sebastian of Levenfeld Pearlstein, LLC, a unique and contribution-driven law firm that was born out of the desire to be different and make this world a better place.

[00:54] Introducing Melissa Nelson and Angie Sebastian

[05:18] Starting in the Legal Industry

[07:40] Every person matters

[12:16] How to make people feel valued and connected to each other

[18:59] The LP way and how it stood the test of time

[28:54] The Future of the LP Way

[36:22] Lighting Round: A Series of Brief Questions

Melissa works as the Director of Professional Development at LP. She got her master’s degree in Leadership and Organizational Development because she believed there were better ways to be a leader. After completing her master’s program, she began working in professional development in the legal industry.

Angie is the Chief Executive Officer at LP. She has her MBA, oversees the organization’s financial and operational functions, and is responsible for the execution of the firm-wide business plan. She considers herself so lucky to have been part of LP since almost the very first day and having created things that never previously existed.

Back then, their firm only had one thing in mind: the things they didn’t want to do. Angie says that it’s as valuable as knowing what to do. Twenty years later, they had come up with a great story and an impactful culture that engages and honors every person that’s part of the firm.

The LP Way has been going on for at least 10 years. Despite its age, it still holds value today and continues to drive business strategies and decisions. The LP Way helps everyone at LP be aligned.

The idea of the LP Way came from the very beginning and has borrowed inspiration from great business leaders. Despite bombarding the people at the start, the leaders at the firm did a great job of simplifying the LP Way into 5 steps that help people at LP understand what their role is, where their relationship is, and how they’re adding value. It was difficult to add or to amend concepts in the LP Way, says Angie. However, they found a strategy to make it work. They didn’t sell things as new. Instead, they made people understand that these are just parts of the pre-established steps. That’s how they prevented resistance.

According to Melissa, they are intentional about finding ways to develop their people and work through the challenges of today. Angie echoed that they embrace the circumstances and find new ways to execute and make it better.

When asked about the future, both women said that they are both excited for the new, emerging leaders at LP. They have developed a succession plan and are partnering with UpSpiral Leadership to prepare and empower these new leaders for the future. Angie emphasized the importance of establishing a path forward for the future leaders of the firm.

Sue Covelli-Buntley and Poyee Chiu of UpSpiral Leadership interview Katleho Mohono, a leadership development facilitator, coach, and speaker. As one of the founding members of the African Leadership University (ALU), he helped establish the institution’s culture, development strategy, and curriculum. Recently, he co-founded NiaDelta, a leadership and education consulting firm that seeks to inspire purposeful change.

[00:36] Introducing Katleho Mohono

[06:01] Katleho’s Passion for Creating Change

[12:42] Dealing with Dichotomy

[18:24] How to Influence People

[21:42] Challenges and Successes in Leadership Development

[28:22] Lightning Round: A Series of Brief Questions

[37:53] The Flip: “Leadership is a Solo Act”

Born and raised in South Africa during the 90s, Katleho grew up at a time when apartheid was ending. He had more access to opportunities that would have otherwise been unavailable a decade before. From a young age, he saw the transformational impact of prominent figures like Nelson Mandela. His early experiences had a profound effect on him, leading him to become passionate about leadership. Coincidentally, he also realized that he was a persuasive communicator.

Katleho’s schooling years were an interesting phase for him. Although his family wasn’t wealthy, he was able to attend a private school. His neighbors teased him for being more well-off. Meanwhile, he couldn’t quite fit in with his classmates’ lavish lifestyle. This confusing situation taught Katleho how to deal with dichotomy. Instead of taking sides, he is able to take different vantage points. He encourages the practice of empathy instead of judgement.

Another way to deal with contradicting situations was to get comfortable with paradox. It’s all right to have incompatible concepts in the same space. Oftentimes, our preconceived notions hold us back from opportunity and growth. We need to be curious about one another and let our biases go. Ask questions because you’re interested, not because of your own agenda. Curiosity can change how we communicate and work with others.

As Katleho matured, he realized that leadership was about inspiration rather than coercion. Leaders are so passionate about a cause that it encourages others to join in. The drive that they have is on full display, inspiring the people around them to be part of the movement. Now, Katleho is on a mission to help others become the best version of themselves through coaching and training.

When asked what leadership trait the world needs the most, Katleho chose facilitation. A leader should be able to bring people together for a common goal. However, leadership is not solely an individual’s responsibility. There is too much emphasis on individual characters that we forget to focus on the community. We should seek to empower a leadership ecosystem that elevates not only leaders, but the leadership trait itself.

Sue Covelli-Buntley and Poyee Chiu of UpSpiral Leadership interview Lyndon Rego. He is the founder of CoMetta, an initiative that seeks to build and revitalize communities through leadership development and innovation. As a former director for the Center for Creative Leadership (CCL), Lyndon was at the helm of the organization’s different programs. Most notably, he directed CCL’s Leadership Beyond Boundaries effort to make leadership development more accessible all over the world.

[00:30] Introducing Lyndon Rego

[03:18] Lyndon’s Passion for Creating Change

[12:41] Stages of Leadership

[20:31] Being-Knowing-Doing Framework

[26:00] Leadership Beyond Boundaries

[34:54] Lightning Round: A Series of Brief Questions

[42:35] The Flip: “There is Only One Right Answer”

Lyndon spent his formative years in India. This was during the 70s and 80s, when poverty was much more rampant in the country. He recalls seeing a homeless family near the apartment complex he resided in. The Rego family’s middle-class lifestyle was in stark contrast to how people lived on the streets. At the age of 15, Lyndon recognized that he was in a privileged position to be able to help the disadvantaged. Since then, he has wanted to create a positive impact in the lives of the vulnerable.

As a student at the University of North Dakota, Lyndon spearheaded a statewideevent to raise awareness on global hunger and food security. He took on the responsibility even though he felt inexperienced. The project was a stepping stone in Lyndon’s leadership journey. From feeling inadequate, he realized he was capable of so much more

From his own experiences, Lyndon created a framework for leadership development based on the Indian chakra system. At the most basic level is the acknowledgment of self-worth. Marginalized individuals may feel oppressed and worthless. The first step in becoming a leader is believing that you matter. To progress to the second level of leadership, you must determine what you want in life. Circumstances may lead a person to believe that he or she is powerless to take control of destiny. It’s crucial that you make a decision about the direction of your life.

The third stage is about learning and empowerment, where one must figure out how to achieve his or her goals. A level above that is stepping up to become a leader in the context of others. The pitfall here is that an individual might focus on working solely for the benefit of an organization. To avoid this, remember that social entrepreneurs effect change because they champion causes instead of specific groups.

The next level of leadership is seen in figures like Gandhi, Luther King, and Mandela. Social change leaders support not just one cause. They understand that it is not a matter of who is right or wrong, but rather, people must come together to solve challenges. 

Finally, the highest level in Lyndon’s development framework is demonstrated by spiritual leaders like Jesus or the Buddha. Their contributions withstand the test of time because of how relevant they are. They help us focus on the liberation of self⎯how we live and experience the world. This last stage of leadership brings us back full circle: from beginning with self-discovery to the empowerment of others.

Rebecca Braitling, Poyee Chiu, and Sue Covelli-Buntley of UpSpiral Leadership interview Ken Warman. Ken is the founder of The Leader’s Evolution, a leadership consulting firm with the mission to “Build and develop successful people, great leaders, and high-performing teams”. Ken helps his clients become more purpose-driven leaders through his coaching practice and improves their individual and organizational performance. Before founding The Leader’s Evolution, Ken led teams as Chief Financial Officer, Chief Operating Officer, and Head of Consulting Practice for Prudential Financial. He is also a coach with UpSpiral Leadership.

[00:29] Introducing Ken Warman

[10:09] The Leader’s Evolution

[17:27] Finding Your Purpose

[20:22]  What Ken Has Learned about Himself

[22:44] Ken’s Definition of Success

[27:54] The Challenges Ken Has Faced

[30:25] Lightning Round: A Series Of Brief Questions

[38:47] The Flip: Career growth is a series of positions

Adversity instigates change. For Ken, losing his job forced him to pivot. He used the time to reflect on what impact he wanted to have on the world around him and identify the qualities he believed would facilitate that change. The prospect of working with different types of people drove him to start his own company, rather than with a single company and certain kinds of leaders.

To Ken, leadership is an evolution that requires time and considerable effort. In his work, he tries to meet people where they are in their journeys and help them move forward. He aims to help his clients maximize their impact on the people around them and act as a catalyst in their leadership evolution.

It is a worthy endeavor to find your purpose. Finding his passion and helping others find it has been very rewarding for Ken. However, he maintains that finding one’s purpose is very challenging to do in isolation. To propel you forward in your journey, he stresses the importance of having a coach to challenge you and your beliefs. Attempting to find your purpose requires a commitment to the cause and the person you have chosen to help you.

Your purpose changes over the course of your life. The things that motivated him in his 20s are not the same things that inspire Ken now. His purpose and priorities have shifted, so he urges people to take a fresh look at what drives and motivates the person they are in this moment.

It is healthy and exciting to pivot. Ken encourages people to think differently about their career trajectories and what they could do. Many people experience a transformation within their lifetimes that shifts their frame of reference and their priorities, so it’s worth looking into how they can align their career trajectories with their new focus.

Through starting The Leader’s Evolution, Ken learned that he has at least some tolerance for risk, which is in part what allowed him to make such a drastic change at a late stage in his career. His definition of success has developed and changed alongside his career. He sees resilience and consistency as vital traits of success.

According to Ken, career growth is an excellent opportunity to learn, spread our wings, and try things we may struggle with. Greatness is about expanding our horizons, as well as growing and evolving. Ken is energized by people who are inspired when they do something new or do something differently.

Rebecca Braitling, Poyee Chiu, and Sue Covelli-Buntley of UpSpiral Leadership interview Joel Wright, the founding president of the Leadership Forum Community. Rebecca, Poyee, and Sue met Joel almost five years ago through the Leadership Forum, one of the longest-running leadership conferences worldwide. Joel is currently launching Democratizing Leadership Exchange, a resource hub that aims to empower all members of society on exceptional leadership.

[02:32] Introducing Joel Wright

[06:50] Democratizing Leadership

[12:52] Defining the Democratizing Leadership Exchange

[17:22] The Importance of Integrating Leadership Strategies in Schools

[20:34] Challenges Plaguing Leadership Education

[ 32:05] How Leadership can Positively Impact School Life

[34:40] The Lightning Round: A Series of Brief Questions

[41:45] The Flip: “Leadership is for Grownups”

Joel believes everyone can be a leader regardless of their background; we just have to tap into people's leadership potential and offer a little bit of leadership development. In the past, people would only be exposed to leadership training during the latter stages of their career. By this time, it's usually too late, and it becomes a burden to the new leader since they are forced to consume all this new material and still lead others. Moreover, many leaders often say that they wish they had been taught about leadership from a young age. Joel believes we can change the narrative by teaching students about leadership before entering the job market.

Teaching students about leadership packs its own set of unique challenges. First, teachers are already busy as is, and adding extra teaching material to their schedules will be met with frowns. Thus, Joel believes that the only way to do this is by using short and easy-to-implement tools. This way, a teacher will not be burdened with any extra material, and the learner gets to gain leadership training quickly and efficiently.

The past couple of years have witnessed an increased number of schools adopt the democratizing leadership framework. The framework aims to offer learners short learning materials that they can consume and apply to their student lives. This helps them think about how to understand and overcome challenges that they might be going through. Since leadership affects many aspects of a person's life, these tools can also be used to solve challenges plaguing the family unit and the community.

As earlier mentioned, most senior leaders never learned leadership practices and how best to pass on their knowledge. What happens then is that they develop mindsets that limit other people's opportunities to step into leadership positions. As a leader, it's your duty to nurture your team members, especially new employees, and push them to become the leaders they were meant to be. However, as much as you'd love to hold their hand throughout the journey, it would be best if you gave them the freedom to make mistakes. Learn how and when to step back and let the upcoming leaders tap into their creativity and solve problems for themselves.

Poyee Chiu, Sue Covelli-Buntley, and Rebecca Braitling welcome Rodney Davis to another inspiring episode of the UpSpiral Leadership Podcast. Rodney is the co-founder of a video-interviewing technology platform called Bondfire LLC, whose primary focus is connecting the best talent to the best opportunities. He is also the President of L.I.F.E. Support Inc., a nonprofit that offers educational and recreational activities to underserved individuals in Aurora, Illinois and surrounding communities.

Sue Covelli-Buntley and Poyee Chiu of UpSpiral Leadership interview Eric Bailey, best-selling author of The Cure for Stupidity. His consulting firm, Bailey Strategic Innovation Group, has an extensive portfolio of clients which include Google, the US Airforce, and many others. Equipped with a master’s degree in leadership and organizational development, Eric is passionate about using radical curiosity to incite change and understanding.

[00:41] Introducing Eric Bailey
[05:15] Eric’s Passion for Creating Change
[08:18] The Concept of Radical Curiosity
[15:13] The Empathy Gap
[21:54] Creating Boundaries that Unite Instead of Divide
[25:12] “Just Shut Up and Listen”
[36:40] The Lightning Round: A Series of Brief Questions
[47:20] The Flip: “It’s Not Me, It’s Them”

Eric recognizes that all of his life experiences have brought him to where he is today. At the age of 5, he was living on the streets with his family. His mother put herself through dentist school, which eventually improved their living conditions. As an adult, Eric had a colorful career having worked at a restaurant, zoo, and a healthcare company. He obtained his master’s degree from Saint Louis University. During graduate school, he met Dr. John P. Kotter and had the opportunity to work with him for a year. Afterwards, he started his own consulting company that specializes in organization culture and business strategy.

From his experience working in training and development, he noticed that HR departments are fixated on correcting behavior. Similarly, we have the same goal when communicating with others. We enter conversations because we want to prove that we are right. Opinions different from our own are immediately dismissed. No real dialogue can happen because people refuse to take a new vantage point.

Eric explains that this divide is rooted in human nature. We have created tribes as a way for us to know who to trust. In the process of forming groups, we determine who is a friend or foe. If they are not one of our own, then we do not hear them out. Creating an enemy out of the other group feels good because it highlights membership in our tribe. It is this “us vs. them” mentality that creates the empathy gap. When people perceive that they are on different teams, they lose their empathy for the opposing team. Rivals are no longer cared for as human beings.

Judging others has become a learned reflex but there is a way to close the empathy gap. First, you need to be aware that these tribal boundaries are based on perception. Instead of emphasizing differences, choose to look at similarities. Create categories that would put you and your “rivals” on the same team.

Next, replace judgment with radical curiosity. Have that genuine yearning to understand the other person’s context. Let go of your desire to be understood and to be correct. Assume that you are talking to a rational being and find out their why. By identifying the “why”, you’ll see that people aren’t so different after all. From that realization of a shared goal, we can collaborate on a solution to achieve our “why”. Radical curiosity makes space for innovation and possibilities.

Rebecca Braitling of UpSpiral Leadership interviews Elaine Rocha, the Chief of Staff to the President and Global Chief Operating Officer of AIG, a multinational insurance and finance company. While at AIG, Elaine previously served as the Global Chief Operating Officer for their Investments business, and previously as Associate General Counsel and Vice President for several lines of business in General Insurance. She has been recognized throughout her career for her strong leadership and advocacy for diversity and inclusion.

[00:30] Introducing Elaine

[04:07] How Elaine Became a Bold and Authentic Advocate

[09:13]  Dealing with People’s Mistakes as a Leader

[14:01] How to Navigate Career Uncertainty and Changes

[16:16] How to Activate Positive Change

[21:05] Elaine’s Proudest Achievements

[23:10] How to Be a Good Mentor

[25:43] Lightning Round: A Series of Brief Questions

Ever since she was young, Elaine has been driven to advocate for those who cannot defend themselves. During her senior year in high school, Elaine recalls writing a letter to the Superintendent and Board of Education to advocate for her friend who got kicked off the wrestling team for punching someone to defend his sister’s honor. She then attended the Board of Education meeting, and successfully won her first case for her first client, despite not having been to law school at the time. Years later, her friend is still grateful that she took the initiative to step in.

Law and finance are fields with very high expectations. As a leader in these fields, Elaine encourages her subordinates to strive for excellence, she wants them to trust her and to be comfortable. If subordinates make a mistake, she expects them to let her know, so that they can figure out a solution together. Leaders must provide psychological safety and support. She walks in humility and welcomes constructive disagreement from her colleagues, knowing that the best decisions come from making the most of everybody’s strengths and expertise.

Elaine consistently chases and embraces disruption. She cites her transition from legal into investments as an illustration of this attitude of welcoming change. She did not know much about investments, but she took the time to figure it out. She encourages us to ask ourselves, “What is the worst that could happen?” Disruption enables us to learn.

Although she embraces uncertainty, Elaine does not condone nor embrace a lack of preparedness. If you have a passion, and want to invoke change, that is great! But building on this passion, you need to know your stuff, and to be able to “yell with data” to the naysayers and eye rollers.

According to Elaine, to be a great mentor, you need to be willing to be mentored. Using this humility and willingness to learn, you can plant this same posture in your mentees. Mentoring is amongst Elaine’s proudest accomplishments, and she enjoys building trust and shaping change in the lives of others, especially women.

Elaine’s greatest wish for the world is that we stop judging a book by its cover. After some time, we might decide that someone is not worth it. However, never make this decision prematurely. You never know what is going on, and you may risk missing the opportunity to know a wonderful person.

Rebecca Braitling, Poyee Chiu, and Sue Covelli-Buntley interview Judy Sammarco, who has been with UpSpiral Leadership since its inception, and has worked with each of the hosts individually before that. They discuss the importance of a positive mindset, and other tips for getting through tough times.

[00:30] Introducing Judy & What UpSpiral Means to Her

[04:40] Challenges Judy Has Faced

[09:23] Judy’s Battle with Ovarian Cancer

[13:56] How to Navigate Bad News

[18:26] Creating Your Own Reality

[20:15] Best-Case/Worst-Case Scenario Thinking

[23:17] Taking Control of Difficult Situations

[27:07] Lighting Round: A Series of Quick Questions

[32:26] The Flip: “Our Circumstances Define Us”

Throughout Judy’s career and in her battle with ovarian cancer, she exemplified UpSpiral Leadership. Judy shares several tips for dealing with adverse life situations: 1. keep a positive mindset, 2. take care of yourself, and 3. act on whatever is within your control.

According to Judy, cancer patients who sustain a positive mindset live on average 24 months longer than their counterparts. She recalls sitting at her daughter’s eighth-grade graduation and praying & believing that she would get to sit at the high school graduation. At her daughter’s high school graduation, she believed that she would make it to the college graduation. She says that her positive mindset is what keeps her going, and is the reason cancer has not defeated her yet.

Secondly, when dealing with any kind of conflict or bad news, Judy remembers to go to sleep or to more generally take care of herself before acting. This leads to better, and more rational decisions. Finally, Judy says she has always believed that she can make a difference. Even in scenarios that are very stressful, such as waiting for a medical test result, she finds some way to influence the outcome, for example by getting a second opinion. She knows what  is within her control and acts on it. At work, she describes being a spokesperson for various parties and not being afraid to speak up.

Rebecca Braitling of UpSpiral Leadership interviews the board of the Women in Industry, Science and Engineering at Regeneron (WISER) employee interest group. Regeneron is a pharmaceutical company in Tarrytown, New York. The board of the WISER group is composed of Rachel Kumar, Cindy Chen, Jennifer Liang and Belinda Tang. They discuss what WISER does, the impact of the challenges that they face as the board of this women’s employee interest group, and how building a community has contributed to their own growth and the growth of others.

[01:20] Introducing the Guests

[05:16] Why WISER is Important to Each Guest

[11:04] What WISER Does

[13:04] The Impact of WISER

[16:40] Challenges Faced in Building WISER

[23:29] Staying Motivated

[29:54] Lessons Learned

[34:08] Lighting Round: A Series of Quick Questions

All four board members have a history of involvement in diversity groups or groups for women in STEM in high school and/or college. Coming into Regeneron, they craved a community where like-minded women could learn together and support one another. WISER’s official mission is “to provide an inclusive platform for networking & mentorship at Regeneron while supporting women through professional development, well-being and community outreach activities.” The group provides programming, networking and education such as International Women’s Day, an online platform for community discussions, mentorship events, and service activities such as leading girl scouts troops.

The board members share how organizing events such as these has helped each of them to develop their confidence, to be more willing to ask for help, to build stronger relationships, and to be more intentional in the way that they organize their time. When asked how they stay motivated to keep working on the WISER group, they cite the pleasure of witnessing their events make employees feel seen, happier and more equipped to excel professionally.